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First timer 302 swap 94 f150 into 86CV

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    #31
    Oops, think oem HO TB is 58mmÖ


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      #32
      If I do go the route of replacing the cam, I think it be easier to purchase something new or different, vs removing one from the worn engine. Is there a size I can consider aside from the stock?

      These are used available locally: (ad reads)

      The first camshaft is a Kaufmann custom grind camshaft for a SBF 302 351w. This camshaft has 3000 kmís on it. It is a solid roller camshaft, it was in a 351w based 408w stroker. The intake lift with 1.6 rockers is 0.616 in and the intake duration is 304 @ 050 lift. The exhaust lift with 1.6 rockers is 0.640 in and the exhaust duration is 308 @ 050 lift. This camshaft is like new. $200.00 firm

      The second camshaft is a comp cams camshaft that I had in a 302 engine but it would also work just fine in a 351w based engine. It is a hydraulic roller camshaft. The duration @ .050 on both intake and exhaust is 230, the lift on both intake and exhaust with 1.6 rockers is 0.603, the lobe separation is 114 and lobe separation is 110. This camshaft has less than 8000 kmís on it. 200.00 firm.

      No clue really, but my guess is these are too aggressive.

      [emoji120]


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        #33
        Originally posted by 86CVLTDGuy View Post
        To avoid the cam removal, can I not move some wires around to appease the ecm?
        No. I may not have this technically accurate, but in layman's terms the injector "firing" order is controlled by 2 controllers in the ECM, 1 per bank/side. So when there is a condition to increase or decrease injector duration it will incorrectly do this based on reading from the O2 sensors which are measuring per bank/side/controller. When it doesn't see the result it expects because it is not adjusting the injector it thought it was it then will try to compensate more.
        Vic

        ~ 1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS - new DD
        ~ 1991 Mercury Grand Marquis LS "The Scab" - plenty of rot, backup/summer cruiser
        ~ 1997 GMC Yukon SLT - wannabe winter DD - many issues, returning sometime in the 2020s
        ~ 1991 Mercury Grand Marquis GS "The Ice Car" - Rotting Retired Winter DD
        ~ 1989 Mercury Grand Marquis GS - Rotting Retired DD
        Gone but not forgotten:
        ~ 1988 Country Squire ~ 1987 Ford Crown Vic

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          #34
          First timer 302 swap 94 f150 into 86CV

          Originally posted by VicCrownVic View Post
          No. I may not have this technically accurate, but in layman's terms the injector "firing" order is controlled by 2 controllers in the ECM, 1 per bank/side. So when there is a condition to increase or decrease injector duration it will incorrectly do this based on reading from the O2 sensors which are measuring per bank/side/controller. When it doesn't see the result it expects because it is not adjusting the injector it thought it was it then will try to compensate more.
          Makes sense. Thank You.

          Iím maybe getting ahead of myself, hung up on all the possibilities, now considering the cam has to go:



          Thinking Iíll start by removing items from the truck engine hoping to replace whatís needed with new or different donor parts.

          Worried that simultaneously removing parts from the CV and adding them to the truck motor could leave me with gaps of time / not remembering how items come apart etc.

          In my head Iím saying - stay warm in the garage get the truck motor ready. Then come time for the swap, itís a quicker turnaround and less room for error. Allows me to use the car up until swapping vs inoperable parked with parts stripped. Guessing most of the overlap / no run time will be when the accessories come off, hopefully just prior to swapping.

          Seems I can safely start tearing down the truck motor without worry of where items belong?

          If I know one thingÖit never usually goes as planned! FFS! [emoji41]


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          Last edited by 86CVLTDGuy; 10-26-2022, 10:49 AM.

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            #35
            Ha, yes, things often don't go as planned when so many variables are involved.
            Makes sense to me that tearing the truck engine down now is no issue since you would really want it all to go back together in the car configuration.
            Vic

            ~ 1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS - new DD
            ~ 1991 Mercury Grand Marquis LS "The Scab" - plenty of rot, backup/summer cruiser
            ~ 1997 GMC Yukon SLT - wannabe winter DD - many issues, returning sometime in the 2020s
            ~ 1991 Mercury Grand Marquis GS "The Ice Car" - Rotting Retired Winter DD
            ~ 1989 Mercury Grand Marquis GS - Rotting Retired DD
            Gone but not forgotten:
            ~ 1988 Country Squire ~ 1987 Ford Crown Vic

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              #36
              Sprayed most of the fasteners with Some PB blasterÖ hoping for the cleanest disassembly. [emoji1696]


              Wondering how it would work or if itís possible to swap an ecm? Something I could consider?


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                #37
                Since you are swapping the cam anyway, and you have the truck heads and orange top injectors... I vote it's time to just find an HO cam and ECM and do the HO conversion and gain a pretty decent chunk of horsepower. Plus it's all matched so the ECM plays nice because it's what Ford intended.

                The ECM would need to come from an 87-88 Mustang with an automatic, or a HO Lincoln Mark VII (88?-92). Cam could come from the Lincoln or any 86/95 Mustang 5.0.
                1990 Country Squire - weekend cruiser, next project
                1988 Crown Vic LTD Wagon - waiting in the wings

                GMN Box Panther History
                Box Panther Horsepower and Torque Ratings
                Box Panther Production Numbers

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                  #38
                  Okay!
                  Safe to say Iím on the look out for:

                  HO cam
                  HO ECM
                  HO upper intake and TB.

                  A few guys in my area seem to have their own little collection of used parts available.
                  Hoping to grab all of what I need in one place, at a package price.

                  Any other critical needed parts on this HO conversion?

                  Thanks again!


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                    #39
                    What is your area?

                    Perhaps you might want to add that and vehicle data to your profile and signature just to avoid confusion.
                    03 Marauder DBP, HS, 6disk, Organizer Mods> LED's in & Out, M&Z rear control arms, Oil deflector, U-Haul Trans Pan, Blue Fuzzy Dice
                    02 SL500 Silver Arrow
                    08 TC Signature Limited, HID's Mods>235/55-17 Z rated Cooper Zeon RS3-A, Addco 1" rear Sway, Posi, Compustar Remote Start, floor liners, trunk organizer, Two part Sun Visors, B&M Trans drain Plug, Winter=05 Mustang GT rims, Nokian Hakkapeliitta R-2 235/55-17
                    08 Escape Limited V6 Auto, Beamtech LED headlight bulbs,

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                      #40
                      I believe if you're using a Mustang or Mk VII ECU, you'll want the matching fuel injectors. 19 lbs, I think? They should have orange tops.
                      1987 Lincoln Town Car - Signature, "Prudence"

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                        #41
                        Originally posted by jaywish View Post
                        What is your area?

                        Perhaps you might want to add that and vehicle data to your profile and signature just to avoid confusion.
                        Iím up in northern Alberta, Canada. BrrrrÖ[emoji3063]


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                          #42
                          so I didn't read every reply.

                          DO NOT shuffle injector wires around. The ECM firing order must match the camshaft firing order period. If you try and fake it, the fuel trim will not work as expected since one of the cylinders that are firing on bank 1 will physically be spraying fuel into bank 2. With a batch fire truck none of this matters, one O2 sensor, 2 injector drivers. SEFI does not like this.

                          Don't waste your time with the stock cam either. Its crap and makes no power. The truck cam in 94 or so was the Explorer cam. Its like the stock cam on steroids. Still makes no power over 4500 rpm but under that it does a lot better.

                          The HO cam makes lousy power under 2500, so unless you are changing the gears, its going to suck. With a 273 o 308, you'll have a much more useful driving experience with the truck cam. 355 or better, the HO cam works well.

                          Find a Mark VII ECM and it should run OK. Plug it in, run the 19# injectors. Roller cams is roller cams so far as the distributor is concerned. Use whichever one is prettier. Find a ported stock lower intake, run the HO upper, modified HO throttle body, and a bored out stock EGR spacer to sit between it all. Should run quite fine, and probably will make 200-ish hp.

                          86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
                          5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

                          91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC SE, triple black (Timewarp) - poly front bushings, KYB struts and shocks, Holley SystemMax1 lower intake, SilverFox AOD valve body,

                          1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

                          Originally posted by phayzer5
                          I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

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                            #43
                            First timer 302 swap 94 f150 into 86CV

                            Originally posted by gadget73 View Post
                            s
                            Don't waste your time with the stock cam either. Its crap and makes no power. The truck cam in 94 or so was the Explorer cam. Its like the stock cam on steroids. Still makes no power over 4500 rpm but under that it does a lot better.

                            The HO cam makes lousy power under 2500, so unless you are changing the gears, its going to suck. With a 273 o 308, you'll have a much more useful driving experience with the truck cam. 355 or better, the HO cam works well.

                            Find a Mark VII ECM and it should run OK. Plug it in, run the 19# injectors. Roller cams is roller cams so far as the distributor is concerned. Use whichever one is prettier. Find a ported stock lower intake, run the HO upper, modified HO throttle body, and a bored out stock EGR spacer to sit between it all. Should run quite fine, and probably will make 200-ish hp.

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                            This is Great! Thanks.
                            Will try it out with the truck cam to start.
                            See how it runs. I can settle with if it runs OK.
                            Last edited by 86CVLTDGuy; 10-29-2022, 12:16 AM.

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                              #44
                              Bit of progress on stripping the truck engine down! No thanks to a stupid T40 bolt buried under the truck plenum!



                              Got all the Mustang parts including the ECM from a 88 automatic. Including the whole harness.

                              Iím trying to label with numbers everything that comes off, but Iím having trouble understanding the wiringÖ

                              Is the plan to reuse the main plug off the 94 truck engine? Will I have to splice the truck wiring in some spots to match the CV connectors?

                              Appreciate the feedback!
                              I do still plan to give it a good clean!


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                                #45
                                Originally posted by 86CVLTDGuy View Post
                                Is the plan to reuse the main plug off the 94 truck engine? Will I have to splice the truck wiring in some spots to match the CV connectors?

                                Appreciate the feedback!
                                I do still plan to give it a good clean!
                                Do not use the truck harness. You can completely re-use your factory wiring harness. There is no need to attempt splicing harnesses together. Just totally remove the old truck harness and ignore it.

                                You're effectively going to use the block and heads. You'll want to borrow your old valve covers, fuel rail, intake heater pipe adapter with the ECT, timing cover, exhaust manifolds (unless you're going to run shorty headers), and oil pan when you swap the equipment to the truck engine.

                                The Mustang ECU will plug into the factory Panther wiring harness with no modifications.
                                Last edited by Kodachrome Wolf; 11-01-2022, 07:33 PM.

                                My Cars:
                                -1964 Comet 202 (116K Miles) - Long Term Project
                                -1986 Dodge D-150 Royale SE (112K Miles) - Slowly Getting Put Back Together
                                -1987 Grand Marquis Colony Park LS (325K Miles) - April 2017 + September 2019 POTM Winner
                                -1997 Grand Marquis LS (240K Miles) - The Daily Workhorse & March 2015 + January 2019 POTM Winner

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